116 - Marketing Lessons From Unlikely Industries

Zac: If you're only studying B2B, you're missing the best ideas. Liquid Death grew from approximately 110 million in 2022 to 263 million in 2023 by transforming canned water into a rebellious, story-driven brand. It's proof that looking outside your own category can spark strategies most B2B teams never even think about. But we're going to be thinking about them on today's episode.

Rich: All right, well, welcome everybody and welcome Zach. Good to see you. Glad you're liking the new monitor.

Zac: Good to see you too, Rich. If you guys see me looking up, it's because Rich is on one monitor and my prep is on another.

Rich: So Zach is a dual monitor setup now, so we're all good. Um, all right, so in this episode, we're gonna step out of the B2B bubble a little bit and into three very, very different B2C campaigns that shouldn't really work on paper, but they they totally did. Um, for each one, we're gonna break down what happened and the real numbers behind the campaigns, and we will dive a little bit into why these B2C campaigns matter for B2B.

Zac: There's some really interesting ones. I'm ex I'm interested to see what you think, Rich.

Rich: All right. Well, I'm interested to see what Uncle Angelo's eggnog is. We're really getting themed on these drinks now as we get closer to Christmas.

Zac: Yep. We're getting into that late November, early December time of year. Uh, so this one is a punch serving, and it is from a legendary bartender and mixologist Dale de Graff. Uh, in my research on this, I was like, okay, who's Uncle Angelo? Uncle Angelo is actually his Uncle Angelo. And uh there's actually a lot of videos online of this specific recipe of people using it. So it's very popular around the holidays. Uh, it uses a split base of bourbon and spiced rum, real eggs, whole milk, and heavy cream. And then it gets whipped into something that's both fluffy and very easy to drink.

Rich: So all right then. Um, interesting. Glad it's really his Uncle Angelo, not just some made-up fake character. That's great. Uh okay, so let's get into the recipe. Um, just for the record, I do not like eggnog. I think it's disgusting. Um, if somebody made this, I would try it though, potentially. Uh so six eggs separated into yolks and whites. So you can separate those with your fingers, or there's a whole bunch of ways to do it. You can buy an egg separator. Yolks in one bowl, eggs in the other bowl, or uh whites in the other bowl, I guess. Three quarters of a cup granulated sugar divided into two portions, uh, eight ounces of bourbon, four ounces of spiced rum, one quart of whole milk, one pint of heavy cream, and garnish it with freshly grated nutmeg, which sounds absolutely delicious. Okay, so if we're going to, okay, so we're really like, I mean, we're almost making whipped cream with these egg yolks kind of a thing, like, or meringue, I guess it would be. So in a large bowl, you're gonna whisk the egg yolks with about half the sugar until it lightens in color and thickens a little bit. Stir in the bourbon, the spiced rum, the milk, and the cream until everything is fully combined. And then in another bowl, you're gonna beat the egg whites with the remaining sugar until soft peaks form. So, yes, you're making a meringue, 100%. So gently fold roughly one-third of the whipped egg whites into the yolk and spirits mixture to lighten it, keeping the rest aside. So uh fold in. Uh, you've got to fold in the cheese, as Moira Rose said, but no, we're folding in the soft peaks um into the yolk mixture. Okay, I might do this one. Um it's not a traditional eggnog at all. Um, so divide that eggnog into about 12 puncher teacups, or just put it in a punch bowl if you wanted to. Um, you're gonna spoon a little of the reserved whipped egg whites on each serving if you want a little bit of extra foam, and then finish each one off with some freshly grated nutmeg on top. Sounds great. So, fun fact we have a nutmeg grater. It's a little thing that goes in and you do this and it just comes out the bottom. It's very nice. Highly recommend it.

Zac: Yeah, this one's a fun one. Um, I have a family Christmas coming up at the very beginning of December. And it's another one where it's like mold wine, maybe a little bit of this new eggnog we've never tried. Maybe this time they'll uh actually like it compared to the mold wine.

Rich: Yeah, you said the mold wine was not a hit. So I think, I mean, I think honestly, if you didn't necessarily tell people this was like if you didn't tell me this was eggnog and you gave it to me, I would probably eat it or drink it. Um yeah, it looks pretty cool. Yeah. Um fun fun fact, you can also whip egg whites like that and throw them on like hot cocoa or anything like that. You can toast them a little bit, like put them on chocolate. That sounds really good. Yeah. All right. So that's from liquor.com. Thank you to those folks and to uh the legendary Dale de Gruff, who I haven't heard of, but apparently Zach knows who he is.

Zac: Apparently, this recipe is very popular. I was reading a bunch of the comments on one of the YouTube videos, and everyone was like, This is my favorite recipe for like Christmas. And the video was six years old, so it's been around a while.

Rich: Wow, that's fantastic.

Zac: Yeah. So uh, should we get into it?

Rich: Uh, we're gonna talk about three very weird B2C campaigns that uh worked really great and shouldn't have because you look at them on paper and be like, this is insane. Um, but all of them did. So we've got Liquid Death, uh, the Duolingo TikTok campaign. I knew about that one and bringing detour, yeah. Um, which I wasn't, I don't know. I can't remember. I feel like I know the Whopper detour, but I don't remember what it was because I don't do like fast food really.

Zac: So I think it's so interesting. Um, so the interesting stats this time are going to be used to introduce introduce each campaign. Um, so starting with Liquid Death, we kind of teased this in the intro, but in Liquid in 2023, Liquid Death hit about 263 million in retail sales and expanded to roughly 113,000 retail doors across the US and UK, making its third straight year of triple digit growth, which is insane.

Rich: Yeah, and then they grew again in 2024 by almost 100 million too, I think, uh, if I remember right. Okay, so liquid death. Like, go ahead. Sorry, I didn't mean to step on it.

Zac: You're totally fine. So this one to me is probably one of the biggest examples of how like for B2B, of something you could do in B2B that could translate well, or something to at least expand your horizons, maybe not necessarily go as hard as they did, but liquid death sold something that everyone sells the same, right? Water. Canned water. Like, how can you sell water any differently than you already selling it?

Rich: Well, make it sound like it's gonna kill you, for one.

Zac: Make it sound like it's gonna kill you and get people to buy into the actual brand itself with their own unique brand voice. So they turned water into a lifestyle and personality test, which is funny because it's like I know so many of my friends who drink liquid liquid death, and the water, I don't know if you've ever tried it, Rich, but the water is just like it's just water. But like people in my generation specifically, and people that are like more like punk, like you know, like the darker like theme of things love it. And I think it's interesting.

Rich: I think it's like Starbucks is just coffee, and it's not even great coffee. Like sometimes it's a little bit burnt, but I mean, you can build like that lifestyle brand on something very ordinary and boring. Um like it's this one's an interesting one to me because they really like doubled down on the death piece, right? Yep, like just really went hard at that. Um I also love that they did the tall boy beer cans, like beer cell cans.

Zac: Like they look cool when you drink them.

Rich: Yeah, it looks like you're drinking like alcohol, basically, but it's just it's just water. Um, and it sounds like it'll kill you, but really their whole tagline was murder your thirst.

Zac: And they have actually kind of turned into a lifestyle brand too. A lot of their merch does really well from what I've seen. And they do a lot of interesting campaigns, like uh where I don't know, like I I can't what was the one I was thinking of? They do like a lot of campaigns on like social media to try and get people to like join them. I'm pretty sure like one of them was like you could like like sell your soul to like get like free water or something like that. And it's like that wow, that's really leaning into it.

Rich: Really double down on the death piece. So they didn't really have to put much behind this aside from the brand, right? So this wasn't like a big multi-million dollar, multi-billion well, multi-million, I guess, hundred million dollar campaign or anything. It's just they found an audience that resonated really, really well with them. Um, and or that they resonated well with and pushed it hard. Like, yeah, so I see like liquid death t-shirts more than I see liquid death cans of water. Exactly. Because it's just a cool logo, right? Like it's edgy, it's like a little bit dangerous.

Zac: Um they have like different flavors now, they're expanding. They raised funding at a $1.4 billion valuation in 2024, which is like double from 2022. And it's brand awareness is crazy. I mean, if you ask someone what liquid death is, there's probably a pretty good chance they know what it is.

Rich: Yeah, about a third, right? So it's about a 34% like um brand awareness, um, which is about 70 million people who recognize the brand just immediately. Um so that is absolutely huge. Yeah, and I love so I do have friends who drink this as they drink the energy drinks. So they went from water to sparkling water, teas, energy drinks. Um, like probably really making some people in that um non-alcoholic beverage category, like the teas and waters and energy drinks, nervous. Like, because I mean, and you got liquid death energy drink, it sounds like it's going to take you right to the edge of death, which is like hyper energetic, right? Like that's what I would think.

Zac: Mm-hmm.

Rich: And insane.

Zac: It's just interesting, right? So the reason that I associate this like as the campaign to learn from the most is because B2B is a lot of the same boring stuff, right? We're all trying to sell the same stuff. And I think something that you can take away from this, right, is boring isn't a fixed state. If water can become a brand that people can get behind, then things like any B2B industry can get like be a you have a unique brand voice that people can get behind.

Rich: Yeah. Digital marketing, we do campaigns, but like it's there's a lot of people who do that. You know, insurance is a great B2B, like selling business insurance is not the sexiest thing. Um, and I think you saw in the consumer side, Geico kind of did that with insurance, right? With the gecko trying to make it fun, and then they just basically went to whatever's weird and wacky they would um, you know, kind of go with. Um yeah. So yeah, and we we talked about in B2B, like embracing your brand, knowing your brand, embracing your brand and going further with it. And we talk about it with us, like we don't take the antidote thing as far as we could, you know. And I've been like, do we dump it? Do we like keep it and go harder? Like, you know, I hear there's some stuff on the content plan for next year about that, maybe.

Zac: But oh 100%. But yeah, you just you just want to design a brand that buyers want to associate with, create a community. If a lot of the reasons that people are working with you are because I mean, we've said it, people like our vibes and like us as people, make that your brand and make it your unique brand positioning and like your unique brand voice. Like it doesn't have to be boring, not everything has to be the same. I know we've been drilling into that a lot in the last few episodes, but it's true.

Rich: Yeah, how far can you push it? Like the good stuff happens when you're uncomfortable, even with your brand. Like you don't want to completely violate what your brand's about, but a little bit of discomfort and feeling like you're pushing it, especially if you're trying to reach a new audience. And honestly, as you know, Gen Z, uh, well, millennials are definitely decision makers in the workplace now. As Gen Z moves into that, and even the younger folks, like you're going to have to make a shift. And these are the things they grew up on, and these are the things that they resonated with. Now, you don't have to be like, you know, uh the what marketing murder capital or I don't know. Like, I don't even know what it would be, what the exact example would be. Yeah, digital murder. Um, but figuring out kind of what you are and going into it. And I think all of these brands really do that really well. Um and yeah, if you freak out a little bit, like that's okay. Totally fine. So all right. So that was liquid death. So die, like have an edge, have a point of view, dive into it in an entertaining, fun way, and like just double down on your name and your brand and go for it. All right, so uh I'm gonna introduce the next one then. So does that sound okay? Uh so uh there was a Dual Lego TikTok campaign teaching the meaning of hashtags, which generated a 39% click-through rate. If you've ever done anything in digital or in social, 39% click-through rate is outrageous. They had 90 million video views and a 1400% increase in followers for the brand's account.

Zac: So that is insane.

Rich: Like, and right, so they're doing like so Duolingo is like learning a language, right? Like it's you're learning a language. Again, something that has historically been fairly boring. You know, you get used to be CDs, or now it's online, and you just repeat and repeat and repeat, and Duolingo's like, nah, we're gonna do something better. All right.

Zac: They're so honestly, the reason they're so successful is because they're just all in on TikTok and they're unhinged and they're not afraid to push the boundaries. I know that can be pretty like scary for B2B businesses because it's a lot more professional services and things like that. But what you can really take away from Duolingo, right, is they understand the platform well. So they're not afraid to go all in on the platform. And they also really leaned into their brand and the humor of their brand by having a mascot and making it do all the trends on TikTok, making it do unhinged things that you wouldn't expect from it because it drives awareness and it gets more eyes on what Duolingo is. I would say like a good amount of stuff that Duolingo posts isn't even related to their app sometimes. It's their mascot just doing something that's trendy, unhinged, and funny.

Rich: And I think that this goes back to like the people like saying, Oh, should I be on TikTok? Should I follow these trends? And it's like the general advice is only jump into a trend if it man, if it like aligns with your brand. Like make sure that there's something that makes sense. But Duolingo kind of threw that out the window. And it's sort of like when a movie is so bad it's good. They went so far as to just have this owl jump in on every single trend, everything. And so rather than pick and choose what related to, like, you know, learning languages, which I'm sure there's plenty of stuff on there, the owl just does whatever. He's like your crazy friend who like tries to rope you into every single TikTok challenge that ever comes up. And so that I think is an interesting lesson, lesson of just pushing it too far and going all in, but by pushing it too far, you did it just the right amount and you got noticed and you got what you wanted from it.

Zac: Um I think it's interesting what they do with the mascot, right? So their brand is that mascot and they're giving it a personality. It's not just an owl doing random things. You'll because you can kind of expect what the owl will do based off of who Dewe Linguo is as a brand. So it's a really interesting narrative device.

Rich: 15:59

Yeah, I mean, and so for results, like we talked about their social growth and everything. They went from about 50,000 followers to several million followers, which is great. But like we we talk about like followers are a vanity metric, right? Like, yeah, it's there, but what do you get from that? So they have 24.2 million active users. Um, so that is huge.

Zac: It's crazy.

Rich: Um, we don't have the numbers on where they were before this, but probably pretty small and being able to come out. But um they're really, really amazing at how they've converted that social audience into actual purchasers. And then, like you can buy Duolingo, you can buy software, but if you never use it, at some point you're gonna unsubscribe or be done with it. But they're they've got tens of millions of daily active users. I think everybody with a service or an application would want even 10 million daily active users. Holy cow! That's like life-changing for any brand.

Zac: Um, and I think of so much what marketing is now is it's less about sharing what your product and service is sometimes, and it's more about just getting awareness for your brand, right? And catching people's attention. Like Duolingo, like I said, it doesn't necessarily just talk about the app itself. They are pretty like cheeky with how they throw it in there, but it's more focused on grabbing your attention because again, the attention economy is so crowded that you only have a few seconds anyway. You might as well do something memorable that makes your brand memorable. So when people see it, it'll drive them back to it.

Rich: Yeah. And and just like, you know, somehow I have no idea how, but damn, that all is crazy. I should learn Italian. It just connects in some weird way and works. I think the other piece of it though, to your point, is it's that awareness piece, right? So if you were thinking of studying a language, I would rather study one that has a fun, like with a with a company that has a fun personality and brand, because my guess is the lessons are going to be a little bit more fun. The lessons might even contain some unhinged elements, um, you know, some unusual things that they might teach you. Like that would be where I would go with that. So it doesn't necessarily mean people like suddenly want to sign up and learn another language, but if you're already considering it and you've got the choice between like this boring black and yellow logo over here that just has like playlists that you download and you go through them all and you learn stuff, or Duolingo, which does have a different methodology to it as well. And I think the crazy unhinged owl like ties in with their slightly unorthodox way to learn languages.

Zac: So there is a tie-in there though, but it's um it's smart and it's calculated and it's not necessarily the entire focus. I mean, look at how much like look at the success they've had with it. It obviously is like a formula for success. So Yep.

Rich: And mascots can be hard too. Yeah like you've really got to have a point of view with their mascot um and have somebody like managing that personality for you or a team and really have it well defined. So all right, so should every B2B brand just go get a mascot and do crazy stuff on TikTok? That's not what we're saying.

Zac: Not at all. No. But again, it goes back to your unique brand voice, right? You need to have a unique brand voice and you need to honestly, you need to have some kind of character in the way that you're like putting things out there, right? Like ways of driving awareness, ways to get your unique voice out. And also, I think another lesson from this is just understanding the platform that you're putting yourself on. Because if you have a deep understanding of that, it'll be it'll you'll be able to drive more success across Ali channels as well. So Yeah.

Rich: And I think that them narrowing to like just really focus on TikTok, just saying, look, this is where we're gonna get the youngest audience. They're gonna be edgier, they're gonna be weirder, there's all these trends and stuff that happen on here. So we're just gonna jump onto that um and just double down on it. I mean, it's a risk, right? Like to pick one channel and just be like, we're gonna go all in on this. But then you get the buzz and people share outside of that space, right? Like I don't have TikTok, uh, which I mean, I'm old, I shouldn't have TikTok probably. People don't want me on there. But um, I see TikTok videos because people reshare them as reels or somebody sends it to me as a link in text. Um, so they do, you know, move outside the platform as well. And so I think as a B2B um, you know, marketer or B2B business, find a platform that works and give it six months and just double down on it. Ignore everything else and just nail that platform that has your audience and do something that's true to that platform.

Zac: Or if there's already a platform that's driving growth or that's showing potential like that, figure out what you need to do to take it to the next level.

unknown: Yeah.

Rich: How do you get noticed? What are other people doing? What content are people consuming? And what works for you? It doesn't have to be an unhinged owl, like Duolingo, like, you know, it's like it's like lightning striking, right? With some of those. Um, you know, it worked really well for them, but they did it and they own that and they own that space. They own that kind of chaotic, crazy character space.

Zac: Um they found their invisible differentiators.

unknown: Yeah.

Rich: I mean, T-Mobile used to have it with their old um, their old CEO. He did weird, crazy stuff on mostly on YouTube, um, where he would like speak directly to people and he would just do weird stuff and talk about how they're just doing things differently in the industry, you know. No taxes and fees, it's all just included. If we say $35, it's $35.

Zac: Now that's kind of Mint Mobile now, too, in that space, right? Where it's that's kind of yeah.

Rich: Yeah, mint is there. Um, I mean, there's a few other ones that were there, but T-Mobile, like prepaid carriers, did that because it was easier and they had a lot of people paying in cash, and it's so much easier to not deal with sense and you know, with change in cash. Um but T-Mobile was the first kind of major carrier to do it. Um, and it resonated with people. Like it's really, really handy.

Zac: Yeah, and that's a good example of that. We do have one last one, and I really want to share this one because I think it's the funniest one of the group. And when I I didn't know this happened, but the fact that this happened is just it's an awesome idea and it's really creative, and it's a really fun way of like poking fun at your competitors. So, for those that don't know what Burger King's Whopper Detour is, it's a stunt that drove more than 1.5 million app downloads for Burger King, 3.5 billion impressions, and around 40 million dollars in earned media, a 37 to 1 return on investment, which is bonkers. But basically, what it is is Burger King gave people a one cent Whopper deal. If they were standing next to a McDonald's when they opened or downloaded the Burger King app, it was that's just such a funny idea. Like, I could not wrap my head around that one.

Rich: Great use of geofencing, right? Like people think, oh, I should geofence my location and remind people when they're nearby that they should come here. No, they were like, when you were getting close to going to our main competitor, we're going to give you our product for a penny. Um, which I I wonder how many people steered away from a McDonald's and just like got back in their car and drove to drove to Burger King.

Zac: It’s such a good idea because it's like one, like Mc McDonald's was probably so pissed about that. But also, like, you're just driving so much revenue. And like if you're getting a one cent Whopper, okay, I can probably afford to get fries and a large drink and like one cent is nothing. And just like to get people to download your uh app, which I'm sure was the primary goal here, that is just like brilliant. Like that is such a good idea.

Rich: Yeah, because this was fairly early on the food ordering apps, I believe, um, when this actually hit. I don't think it was you know as ubiquitous as it was because what was this pre-COVID?

Zac: Oh, I don't even I I didn't even see the date for this actually.

Rich: Let me look it up.

unknown: Utah.

Zac: It definitely could have been. So something that I think is interesting and how they came to the conclusion to run this campaign is they started with a very clear business goal, right? Let's see how we can get app downloads because we need people to download our app. What's and you break that idea, right? You don't just say, okay, let's run a campaign to generate downloads and gain awareness.

Rich: Call to action, download now

Zac: Yeah, you could they could have easily done something like that, ran YouTube ads with like a funny, you know. But they went above and beyond to break what they would normally do for a campaign like this. And I think that's something that you should keep in mind as a B2B business is okay, we all have we have a goal of gaining, you know, more website visits. How can you be creative with that goal? How can you push the boundaries of what's normally done? Because at the end of the day, we're not trying to go viral, but if you can push outside of the box, you're bound to see some success, especially if it's as brilliant as this.

Rich: So I was right. This was 2018, it was pre-COVID. So this was before we were all used to having food and having food delivered. This is when DoorDash was like, eh, like, I don't know, like it's kind of awkward to use and it's expensive. This was before, you know, having somebody bring food to your house was ubiquitous, or even ordering in an app and going to pick it up, like through the drive-thru or pick it up in one of the little marked parking spaces. Like, I don't think they had marked parking spaces in 2018 for like buy online, pick up and store for food. So this is huge. I mean, this also gets me to the message and like what's your offer. So I think download our app and anytime you're near a McDonald's, or you know, the first time you're in a McDonald's, whatever it was, get a one cent Whopper. It's basically download our app, get a one cent Whopper. You know, there's a little condition inside there about where you have to be geographically. Um the beauty is you can also set this on autopilot, right? Like it just geofencing just runs. And so they had all this set up in the back end, and their message was super easy. And when it got out, like you said, 40 million in earned media, three and a half billion impressions. So earned media. They didn't have to spend 40 million on a campaign because everybody wanted to talk about this. Um it's absolutely ridiculous. Uh so what did they get for it?

Zac: It's so awesome.

Rich: I mean they sold burgers, right?

Zac: Like tons. 37 to 1 return on investment. I'd say that's pretty good.

Rich: Yep. Highest Burger King foot traffic in more than four years for them during this campaign. And that's what you wanted, especially then as retail. You want people to come back. You want people in the door. And it used to be like, oh, run radio ads. And it's like, no, like, no.

Zac: Well, and I think it's interesting that they played offense and not defense, right? Like, the most we see with like playing offense with competitors in B2B is like, oh, we'll try and rank for the same keywords, branded keywords as them, so that when people search their brand, we can like a company, we can be on top. But I think there's like interesting ways you could go about it if you really think outside of the box, which has me thinking, like, how can we play offense for some of our clients, right? Like, what can we do to like go above and beyond just ranking for keywords that our competitors would?

Rich: So one of the things we did when I was at cricket is whenever we went into a new market, uh, one we before anybody knew we were coming in there, which was really early. Because like when you start building towers and you get licenses for like everybody knows you're coming in and all your competitors do. So from a marketing standpoint, our agency would go in with an unnamed client long before we're going into the market, and they would reserve billboards um near or ideally above or right next door to competitors' locations. Um, if we were in a market where the competitor had a headquarters, we would put a billboard on the way to and on the way out of their headquarters. Um, there was one time um we actually put a billboard uh on the route that the CEO of a competing company would take to and from work, specifically messaged at him. So those kinds of things can be fun. It reminds me of um have have you seen the Wendy's billboard, like that's outside the McDonald's where she's just like looking through the trees like this?

Zac: Yeah, like I've seen it.

Rich: It's so hilarious. So you can use outdoor like that, you can use digital like that. Um, there's interesting things you you can do with digital out of home um with displays and things, and having messages come up when somebody with a specific device is within that radius of that sign. Um very, very interesting. So I think this one is that playing offense is really you're nailed at the key to this one is how do you get ahead of it and like catch your competitor off balance, like throw them off balance to catch them off guard.

Zac: Um and how do you take simple campaign goals and go outside of the box with them? How do you achieve those goals in a way that others haven't so you can beat that sea of sameness? I feel like that's my like catchphrase lately is like sea of sameness, but it really is a lot of the same stuff, and you really need to think outside the box.

Rich: So a hundred percent. I mean, and this one's a little bit harder because like I also think like think about your offer too. Um, you know, a lot of places do a free consult, they'll do a free, like we'll do a free audit of your social media, those types of things. Those are things that we could put out in front of somebody. Um I also wonder, so sometimes that um the one cent burger probably performed better in testing than the free whopper because a free whopper has no value. A one cent whopper is discounted, whatever the price is, down to one cent. Yep. Um, same reason that retail Nebraska Furniture Mart does this all the time. It's a purchase with purchase instead of a gift with purchase. If you buy this couch, then you can buy well, a big better one is if you buy this. This oven, you can get this turkey roasting kit for just five dollars. But they make you pay for it because then it has value, you know, and they say, you know, regular retail value of $50 or whatever it is. Um, so the penny was interesting for me here too.

Zac: It's all interesting. I love those campaigns. Like a lot of them are just like, I just want it just makes me think what we can do to like emulate or like come up with ideas to really think outside the box. It just, oh, it's just fun. And you can push it right up to the line of petty.

Rich: Like you're like being petty is a little bit like sometimes you can go over the line. I know we have a couple of times. Um, but you know, getting it right up there and making sure that you're getting that that humor and impact benefit for whatever kind of chaotic evil you've got going on within this campaign as well. So these are good, these are fun.

Zac: Yeah.

Rich: All right.

Zac: That's an episode.

Rich: It is. So uh thanks everybody for listening. We are super happy um that you're here and we hope you found this interesting. And definitely let us know. So Zach will let you know how to do that.

Zac: Yeah, you can find our agency at editou71.com and all of our socials that are there as well. If you have a question you'd like to send our way, head it to head to CTA Podcast. Your question will make it into a future episode of the podcast.

Rich: All right. Uh, and we will be back next week, I believe, with another episode. See you next week.