This week, we’re exploring the fundamental differences and strategies between B2B (Business-to-Business) and B2C (Business-to-Consumer) marketing. Whether you're a seasoned marketer or just starting out, understanding these two distinct approaches is crucial for crafting effective campaigns.
Nicholas Boden created an Italian version of the Espresso Martini for Tavernonna Italian Kitchen, located in Hotel Phillips, Kansas City, Missouri. Traditionally, the Espresso Martini features vodka. Instead, Boden’s take resembles a slightly boozy espresso shot. It combines espresso with amaro and Kahlúa, resulting in a rich, dark, and botanical drink that delivers as much caffeine as alcohol, if not more.
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Catelin: Hey, welcome back.
Rich: Hey, Caitlin. Yeah. We're, we're back for another episode. Um, it seems like it's been forever.
Catelin: Has it? I think it was just like a week ago. It's been
Rich: like a week. Yeah. I mean, it's always a week. So unless Zach screws something up, but it's, he's been really good and he's cranking these things out.
Rich: So
Catelin: I don't think it's Zach's fault any longer if things go wrong. No, I don't think so either. He's
Rich: got that machine rolling. Um, so before we get too far off. Yeah. Are you going to tell what we're was going to do
Catelin: it. Uh, we've got an Italian espresso martini, but more importantly, we're also understanding the nuances of B2B and B2C marketing, which is still something that we're working on.
Catelin: That I'm working on.
Rich: Namely what the B's are and what the C is. Uh, the two is just an abbreviation for T O. It's just a number two. Yeah. Um, I was like, normally
Catelin: I know what B's and C's are, but I don't think it's those B's and C's. So.
Rich: Yeah, B2B business to business, B2C business to consumers. Correct. Um, so like, you and me buying stuff for ourselves at our houses, and then B2B
Catelin: is buying
Rich: Yes.
Rich: Yes, you're a C. And then, we're also a B when we buy things for our business, but like, we can do toilet paper B2B, or B2C, cause our business needs toilet paper. I don't know why I chose that one. Except that I think you guys have a lot of it now. Cause I think it double ordered, but honestly better to have too much toilet paper, correct, then not enough.
Catelin: Do you know that this is my first tangent for the episode, um, in COVID, no, that, um, There was like an oversupply of commercial toilet paper because nobody was going to the office or like commercial areas. And so they had to like supply chain change how stuff was distributed because they had this overproduction of commercial grade, but no residential like consumer grade stuff.
Catelin: I should
Rich: have put that giant. double roll thing that they have in public bathrooms in my bathroom and then ordered from amazon business and
Catelin: I think so I could have
Rich: had tons of toilet paper we just we put in bidets we got the um the bio bidet uh
Catelin: yeah
Rich: and it was it's just um it's actually kind of nice Like that's when I stay at the warrior hotel in Sioux city, they have bidets in every room.
Rich: There's a fancy though. Like they got programming and like all kinds of things you can do with
Catelin: that. I don't think I like that idea. I think I would get used to it, but I think the idea is still, um, tough for me.
Rich: There's a comedian who does a thing about the first time you use a bidet. You, you learn a lot about yourself and it may make you question, um, a lot of things, uh, but it does get you clean.
Rich: Yeah, I believe that gets you clean. I believe that. Um, and I
Catelin: think, yeah, if
Rich: you have too much coffee, you're going to need a bidet. So I think the Italian espresso martini is perfect for this. Oh, side note.
Catelin: Yeah,
Rich: for those of you who are in or around the Omaha area, shout out to Talas on 108th and 370. They have a caramel espresso martini right now.
Rich: And I made the mistake of, um, did
Catelin: you order espresso at dinner?
Rich: I did. I had one at dinner. Um, and then they were like, Do you want another one for dessert? And I'm like, Oh God, no. Like, that would be terrible. So I was laying in bed at like 11pm because I'm old. I go to bed at 9, 9. 30. Like, I collapse. I'm done.
Rich: But I like, didn't feel like it. So I watched the finale of Elite. Um, cause I watch that late at night, um, when everybody else is sleeping. Elite. On Netflix. Uh, it's about a, you would, well, I don't know if you would like it. It's set in Spain, so it's an elite Spanish boarding school where everybody is shitty and murderous.
Rich: Oh,
Catelin: like gossip. Is it kind of like gossip girl? Yeah.
Rich: It's like if gossip girl had a lot of sex and they all spoke Spanish.
Catelin: Okay.
Rich: Um, but it's pretty good. I think it went like five seasons or six, five seasons, six. Anyway, I watched the finale, the series finale of that, which was a good wrap up. Oh my gosh. Um, but then I went to bed and I was like laying there like, why am I still awake?
Rich: And I'm like, oh. Yeah. Espresso. Espresso. Martini. That's why I'm still awake. Um, so this one, um, is a lot of us. Well, it's, it's mostly espresso. Nicholas Bowden invented this. Um, it's a little bit more bitter, a little bit less sweet, but still has that sweet piece in it than your classic espresso martini. Um, and I have not looked to see if this still exists.
Rich: I know in Kansas city, a lot of the restaurants have shifted, but, uh, his bar was at, uh, San Francisco. Tabernona Italian Kitchen at the Hotel Phillips in Kansas City. I don't know if any of those things still exist. We could be there. You could come pick me up on the way because I'm on the way. Yeah. Um, So the most of the important piece of this, it doesn't have vodka.
Rich: Generally, an espresso martini has vodka. That's your base liqueur. Um, and that one, I would say you can't really do gin in an espresso martini. It's a, it gets a little weird. Cause the vodka is just supposed to exist and be alcohol. It's not supposed to add flavor. Um, his is, uh, a little bit more of a boozy espresso shot.
Rich: I know.
Catelin: I really, this sounds very good. To me, like I'm quite excited about this.
Rich: I love the, the Amaro like that. I was like, what? Um, so it's, that makes it a little botanical, but then there's the Kahlua that gives it that creamy, slightly sweetness. Um, so, so how do we make one?
Catelin: Well, you need an ounce of espresso chilled Averna.
Catelin: A half ounce of Kahlua and three coffee beans for garnish. Did you know that's
Rich: luck? If you don't, I learned this on, uh, on what we call the boat show. Um, So it's a below deck, um, they're doing below deck sailing yacht and a guest got really mad that there was only one bean in his espresso martini because three beans it's for, there's three things that it's for.
Rich: It's for like wealth, health, and happiness or something is why the three beans. And I was just like, okay, dude, chill. Like, but I mean, you're on a super yacht, so they should know that.
Catelin: Okay. Well, um, good news. We could go to Tavernona. It still exists. Huh? Now I want to. What are you guys doing this Saturday?
Catelin: You're going to chill a Nick and Nora glass with ice and water and set aside. Brew your shot of espresso and pour that into a shaker over ice to chill. And quickly strain the ice out to avoid excess dilution because that's important.
Rich: It's that little aperitif glass. I was like, what the hell is a Nick and Nora glass?
Rich: Oh yeah. It's the little, it's
Catelin: the little, yeah. It's like a sampler, like a taster glass.
Rich: Well, look at the artwork for the episode. You'll know what it is.
Catelin: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I didn't realize that, um, people didn't know what Nick and Nora glasses, people being you, sorry.
Rich: Obviously seen them and I have had drinks out of them.
Rich: I actually had a drink out of one this weekend in DC, but, um, didn't know. That's what they were
Catelin: called. Anyway, uh, add your Raverna and Kahlua to the shaker with fresh ice and shake vigorously to foam. Uh, strain all of that into the chilled Nick and Nora Glass, and then garnish with your three little coffee beans.
Catelin: And they should just sit really nicely in the foam, like the head of the drink.
Rich: And I think that's one thing. So like, I mean, I'm not a huge fan of the Nespresso's because of the pods and everything, but they do foam and creamy coffees like really well.
Catelin: Yes.
Rich: But so does Ardura. Um, I think if you've got an actual espresso machine, well, you're going to need it to make an espresso shot.
Rich: Like you can't just make coffee and put it in this. It's not going to work. Yeah. That'll be, no. I know. All right, so that one came from our friends at liquor. com Italian chocolate martini, but there's no actual chocolate in it.
Catelin: I think that's maybe, yeah, it's just, uh,
Rich: Do the Kahlua and oh, wait.
Catelin: Yeah, maybe the Kahlua is a little chocolatey.
Catelin: Italian Espresso
Rich: Martini is Italian Chocolate Martini. Yeah, maybe it makes it feel a little chocolate. I don't know.
Zac: Sometimes the URLs are kind of weird, too. Oh, you know what? They're gaming the
Rich: SEO, Zach. They're gaming the SEO for Chocolate Martini and slipping you this bittersweet espresso, Italian Espresso Martini.
Catelin: That's probably actually better.
Rich: Yeah. That's probably what they're doing, honestly. I'm sure it is. Yeah. Cause I was like, wait, that's a weird URL. Uh, all right. So, uh, you can go back to our SEO episode to learn about and why you should or should not do that.
Catelin: It seems a little, it seems a little sketchy liquor.
Catelin: com. I don't know. I don't know. I would feel, I would feel misled.
Rich: Ooh. I had an Italicus drink this weekend and I do not remember what it was at all. Um, it's probably on, I think, no, it's, I didn't pay for that one. So I don't have the receipt. I'd have to ask Brian what it was. Um, but it was this place called Red Hen, their Michelin guide.
Rich: Listed not starred, but they're listed of that it's real good, like crazy good. And they end up like to, they open at five 30. And if you get there at five 30, you can sit on the bar. Um, but like, cause the bar's open seating, but we
Catelin: got
Rich: there at like five 32 because there were three of us and we wanted the corner of the bar.
Rich: Nope, both quarters taken, no corners available. So we had to sit in a line, but F like around six 30 or so they have, not only do they have all the reservations, the whole restaurant's full every single night, but they start doing a backup list for the bar for walk ins. Um, and if you're a group of three, they will not let you take two seats and then wait for somebody on either side.
Rich: Uh, they will put a group of two in there and they will wait for like, Generally two groups of two if that's what they have or a group of three to be checking out And then you'll get in there. It was So good. We went twice because I was like, I was like we could go again Um, and yeah, I had a pork milanese Last night.
Rich: Yum, basically a giant pork fritter. It was good
Catelin: That's a pork tenderloin for those of you in Iowa.
Rich: So yeah, it's just bread and pork. Oh, I think they did like a stick of butter in their bread crumbs though, because those bread crumbs on the outside were the best I've ever had in my life, but they wouldn't tell me why.
Rich: Um, yeah, it was all mine. Now I'm thinking of that and I'm getting hungry cause I didn't eat lunch. All right, well we should probably take a break and come back. Let's do that. B2B, B2C. Dream about some
Catelin: pork tenderloin and uh, B2B, B2C. BRB.
Rich: Hey, we're back Caitlin.
Catelin: We are. I was like, why is my video
Rich: so dark? But it's been, the countdown is going, it greys us out a little bit so we can see the lovely countdown. Um, yeah, I'm ready. B2C.
Catelin: Do you have a favorite?
Rich: Um, I really like retail. And what's funny is we have almost no retail clients. It's just hard though.
Rich: It is so hard, but I mean, I cut my teeth on, um, one of my biggest clients early on was Nebraska Furniture Mart when I was at Redstone in Omaha. Obviously tons and tons of retail. I've done car dealers in multiple agencies. And then in, um, Chicago, it was all the Sears stuff. So Craftsman Tools, tool department, Ken Moore.
Rich: All that good stuff. Um, which was, you know, the part of Sears that was working, which is great. The, you know, towels and linens and ladies dresses were tanking left and right, but YNR had those. We didn't have those. So we, we had all the hard goes. Um, yeah, which by the way, um, Omnicom is buying interpublic group.
Rich: So Omnicom is the number two holding company for ad agencies. Interpublic is the number four and they are buying them and they will become the number one and eclipse WPP if it all goes through. Um, and I can't wait to see the pissing matches between things like Coke and Pepsi and all these conflicts that are going to arise and they're going to be but we'll see.
Rich: That news came out yesterday, I think. And I was like, holy shit, this is crazy.
Catelin: I, M& A just does not make sense to me any at all. It's how
Rich: they grow. There's a small holding company. I can't remember. It's like, starts with an M it's three letters. Um, it's not MRR that's monthly recurring revenue, but I mean, it could be like, just tell people what you want.
Rich: I want monthly recurring revenue at my holding company, but there's a smaller one, um, and they look for agencies that are sort of that, that small to mid size, and they put more of those together. Um, Um, and they look for specialty agencies so they can have, you know, two or three on each client. They can like introduce clients across.
Rich: It was, it's a neat business model, but they're like probably number 20 in size of agency groups.
Catelin: Yeah.
Rich: But yeah, I used to know somebody who worked there all right, so b2b business to business so organizations institutions companies You're trying to sell something to a company or to a person at a company Yeah, and then b2c is just see us
Catelin: Consumers.
Catelin: Here we are. And consume, we do.
Rich: Yep. So that's the biggest difference, I think. I mean, the thing that people forget is that when you're doing B2B, those are people also, and they still have habits like consumers. You do have different messages for them. Um, but that's, uh, That's one of the common misconceptions is like, you know, you're not selling to a giant company, you're selling to people at that company and somebody has to make a decision, other people will influence that decision.
Rich: Or you're
Catelin: selling to multiple people at that company at one time.
Rich: And I think that's one of the biggest things with consumers. It's generally one person or a couple of people in a household, right? Like a joint decision on a car or something like that. Um, at companies, like there are people who influence that decision, who are impacted by it.
Rich: There are multiple people who are going to have to decide like whether or not to buy that thing. So you've got to get into the right people, but also get your message to the other folks who need to see it as well. Um, Um, and no, that doesn't mean that you just email everybody at that company and hope that somebody responds, like, no.
Rich: Um, yeah, so, and we do mostly B2B stuff. We have a little bit of B2C. Um, I enjoy it. It's fun. Um, but it is, uh, it can be more difficult depending on the sector that you're in. Um, I
Catelin: like to think that I know consumers well, but I think I know a specific kind of consumer, which is like middle class white woman with champagne taste and, uh, maybe a beer taste.
Catelin: 18 a bottle budget.
Rich: But you do know how to research audiences though. And pull personas together and put your mind. I think that's the key thing for either of them. It's putting your mind in the place of someone that you're not. I can't even, I don't know what I'm saying. Uh, getting in the mindset of the target.
Rich: Yeah, getting in the mindset and kind of figuring out who they are, even if it's not you. Um, I've sold all kinds of things that I didn't ever like use or understand.
Catelin: Drills or.
Rich: I mean, I used some of those. I mean, I did use like power tools. Like I'm pretty handy and can do like a ceiling fan. You know, replace a light switch and things like that.
Rich: Um, I was trying to work on, um, I think it was Kotex because I needed a package goods experience, which is a special kind of B2C. Um, but they just didn't like the client just really didn't want, uh, a man as an account person on Kotex and I'm like, but as an account person, like that's the least dangerous role for a man on that tool.
Rich: And also like, you know, it's a, it's a package good for a consumer that has a need for it, you know, but, but I ended up doing Propel which I did drink propel for a long time. Um, not so much and all
Catelin: the electrolytes.
Rich: Yeah
Catelin: The reason that b2b frustrates me a little bit is because the sales process is much longer it's more complex it revolves around multiple people and sometimes you don't always have like a full office politics picture Or hierarchy, like there's all these kind of unknown.
Catelin: Not necessarily secret things, but it's, um, tougher to navigate than just like a conversation with one or two people. Yeah.
Rich: And I think that's where you've got to really think about who the decision makers are and like who ultimately is going to make that final decision. Um, and then you've also got like, cause it's a company, right?
Rich: So people join and leave companies all the time. You've got new people who come in and now they want to review. You got somebody who leaves and now gets handed off to somebody else. Um, that happens a lot. Yeah, it's, um, B2B is almost always a considered purchase is the term. Um, something that you have to think about, you research, you look into.
Rich: B2C can have considered purchases like cars, washing machines, those types of things.
Catelin: Um,
Rich: though I feel like any more, Like, I know that if our washing machine died, well, one, it's under warranty, so I would deal with that. But if I had to go, like, buy a new washing machine tomorrow, I would go get an LG again.
Rich: Because we've had LGs for so long, like,
Catelin: that's
Rich: where your brand loyalty really comes in. Uh, with that B2C. B2B, there can be some brand loyalty, but less. It's really more about solving the problem and the function over, you know, everything else. Yep. Yep. Yep. And cars for me are always an impulse purchase, which is terrible.
Rich: If I go test drive a car, I'm probably leaving with it. Like, it's so awful. I should do more research, but it's like, this is fun. Um, but loyalty also plays in there. Um, yeah. So B2C is shorter, comes sometimes impulsive. Um, Hey yo,
Catelin: that's me. Yep.
Rich: Yep. It's like, those pants are cute. Bye. Um, and so it's really about getting your product in front of the person who's going to impulse add to cart and then come back.
Catelin: For me, it's like exposure therapy. Like the more times you send me the, the blue suit with the vest and the skirt and the blade retargeting,
Rich: retargeting works really well. Retargeting works in both. Um, generally with B2B, you're trying to build more awareness and remind them that you're there with B2C.
Rich: You are, if you're doing it well, you're showing them that thing they looked at last and following them around the internet with it. And then my pet peeve, once they purchase it. Stop following them. It is a hundred percent possible to do. I actually just set up a workflow for a B2C client for holiday. We have six emails going out between now and Christmas.
Rich: They pause like they wait until the next one's going out and then it checks to see Did the person make a purchase after the sale started? If so, don't send them the email. You're just gonna wear them out We're gonna waste an email. If no, send them the next email, move them down You can actually get that with retargeting all the way down to the individual products And if you use Shopify, like we, well, we've got a whole thing on that.
Rich: We did an episode a while back. Um, but there's a couple of services that Shopify ties into for retargeting, and it actually reads your entire database, every URL, all products, all pages, so you can stop when somebody has completed a purchase of a product. Of a specific product, but you can also then target an adjacent product.
Rich: Like you loved those pants, Caitlin, we're going to show you this wonderful, like pashmina that goes with them or something.
Catelin: Yep. I need the purt purses. I bought a purse. Please stop sending me ads for purses.
Rich: Oh,
Catelin: that was just like me putting it. If you're listening.
Rich: Oh, they're always listening.
Catelin: That's what I mean.
Catelin: Just stop. I it's, it's being delivered tomorrow. Please leave me alone. I went so far as to, I think we've talked about this, but I had to ask AI because I got so sick of searching. I was like, what bag do I AI
Rich: to go search for it. Tell
Catelin: me, tell me which bags have these features. And then I think one of the options was, Spit out or it like led me to click on the thing that got me the ad for the thing that I actually want.
Rich: Yeah. Yeah. The adjacency of that stuff. And, um, yeah. Optimizing your content for AI. There's a whole other blog, blog posts, episode, special TV show, after school special, I don't know. Um,
Catelin: I don't think they do those anymore.
Rich: So marketing goals, um, generally with B2B, you're trying to get that lead. Like you work through the funnel though, right?
Rich: So you want them to be aware of you. You want to share solutions, make sure they know there's a problem. You can solve the problem and then ideally get that lead so that you can talk to them about how you solve the problem. Um, B2C, we talked about awareness already and loyalty. That's huge. Um, yeah.
Rich: Because I'm going to come look for you. What was interesting is I just, again, was going over some retail stuff, um, for a client, uh, and they do clothing and. Got into the, Oh, like people who are, um, direct traffic are spending like two X the cart value of people who find you on Google. And Facebook was like the worst.
Rich: It was the lowest was high volume. And he was like, why? And I'm like, because they know you and they came back and they came back for a thing and they're not price shoppers. Um, And so those types of things, that's loyalty. I remember your name. I type it in. I didn't have to type it in Google and click through from there.
Rich: Cause that's not coming in as a direct, um, uh, direct, uh, link. So yeah. Um, and then customer acquisition and retention, that retention piece is huge, um, for your consumer. So if you bought those pants, they want you to come look at new pants when they've got them, Caitlin, your purse. When they feel like you might be wearing out, they need you to come back and look at more purses.
Catelin: Yeah.
Rich: Um, but they shouldn't drown you in purses right now. That's, that's terrible.
Catelin: Well, and it's like multiple different brands where they're like, Oh, this, you didn't buy my
Rich: brand.
Catelin: Well, and it's like, yeah, I'm sure that they have so many different parameters, right? Cause most of my ads come through social media.
Catelin: And so, you know, I'm, I'm certain that that's, you know, somebody is like, when you, if somebody has looked at an ad for this, show them our ad and, Oh,
Rich: my, my other favorite thing though, is, uh, if we're at work and we're all on the same IP address going out, somebody searches for like cat socks, then everybody starts getting ads for cat socks.
Rich: Um, so you'd have to watch what you search for. Um, though I've seen people use this for Christmas lists, I will search for the things that I want and hope that my significant other on the same internet, for those things.
Catelin: Smart. Okay. Did it work?
Rich: Um, I don't know. I don't do that because I just, I don't ever want anything.
Rich: So if I want something I'll like, like the last thing I wanted was the meta quest thing. I was like, okay. Or I mean, that's that in Lego. Like those are my things. Yeah. Um, Yeah, so, um, value when you're marketing to each of these is completely different. So, uh, Value in B2B, Caitlin, what's value in B2B? I'm like, I'm like quizzing you, you know, this,
Catelin: I don't know.
Rich: It's like, what do I get for giving you my information? Right? Like, Oh yeah. And if you want, I'm like, we do this all the time. You know, these things,
Catelin: we do that. Yes. Yes. Well, and that's, I think that's become one of my biggest like, awarenesses for, for B2B folks too, is like your form is too long. Like that's one of my first considerations where I'm like, nobody's filling this form out.
Catelin: It's too long. I know that you think you want this information, but you just have to stick with this lead a little bit longer for this to be worth it. So like, shorten your form, and then let's set up an email drip. Yeah, the whole I have
Rich: to camp, I have to grab everybody immediately and close the door.
Rich: Right here on this one form. It's like, no. You need to be able to get the conversation, like have a short form and then a drip to try to get the meeting that shares useful information with them, then move on. So that's part of that longer like lead time. Right.
Catelin: Um,
Rich: but it's really about like, I'll give you my email address for almost anything because I can unsubscribe.
Rich: I'm not really worried about it.
Catelin: I just, I just did a little inbox clean out earlier today. Oh, really good.
Rich: Black Friday is a wonderful time for that because everybody emails you 20 times a day. Everybody and
Catelin: their dogs. For sure. I
Rich: just, um, I just archived all of my personal email. I have like, I guess there's three that I use and I archived everything.
Rich: Yeah. And now as stuff is coming in, I'm deleting our archiving or unsubscribing and then deleting our, um, so I'm working on that right now as we get through Christmas.
Catelin: It feels good, doesn't it?
Rich: But yeah, I mean, for, for B2B, it's about information and I'm going to guard my phone number pretty heavily. Um, if you want my address, you better be sending me like booze.
Rich: If you want my address, like I need a, a drizzly come in my way or something.
Catelin: I was thinking about this. Can you unsubscribe from junk mail?
Rich: Yes, it is hard to do. I thought so. So one of the things you can do is put there. Like write stop in really big sharpie letters on whatever they send you and put it back in their postage paid envelope and send it back to them.
Rich: And eventually they'll remove you because they're paying for all that postage going back. And you're helping support the post office, which is always good too.
Catelin: Okay.
Rich: I could get
Catelin: behind that as an idea. Mm hmm.
Rich: Yeah, I mean I have worse ones if you want to like, you know, Go do harmless crime. But, um, that's one of the safer ones.
Catelin: I'm into harmless crime. Tell me about that.
Rich: Don't not here. If it happens, I don't want it recorded.
Catelin: Some vigilante shit. I'm ready. So
Rich: here, when it comes to me to see though, like. I'm going to give you my information because I want to buy something, right? So I have to give you my information at some point, credit card, phone number, address, everything.
Rich: But how was that bag on sale, Caitlin, or did you buy it at full price?
Catelin: I absolutely got a discount code. I signed up for their email list. I got a discount code. I use the discount code. I immediately unsubscribed.
Rich: Yep. Do you remember how much the discount code was like
Catelin: 10%? It wasn't huge, but.
Rich: I know I should
Catelin: have, yeah, I should have held out, but I needed the, I needed the bag.
Catelin: I mean, I didn't need the bag, let's be very honest. But I wanted the bag and I had found the Holy Grail.
Rich: Well, I get sucked in with Stitch Fix because if you buy everything they send you, it's 25%, but this time I got to pick all of my items. So why would I not keep that? I guess if they, well, if they don't fit, you can send it back for free and they'll send you a new size for free.
Rich: Um, I had to do that with shoes. They were like, there was like an inch and a half. between my toe and the front of the shoe and that just seemed like I would triple. I've
Catelin: never had that happen. Yeah, so with B2C, My shoes are always too small.
Rich: Typically it's a 15 percent, uh, is about the minimum you should do because 10 percent is like tax and people are like, yeah.
Rich: Bite me. Yeah. Um, the higher you go, the more likely you are to make the sale, but then you cut into your margin. So you've got to really find that sweet spot. The other one with B2C that a lot of people don't do, and you can do this with B2B too, if you do discounts, keep a list in your CRM of your full price purchasers.
Rich: If you buy from me at full price, I never want you to see a discount code. I want to hide it when you come to the website. I don't want to email you coupon codes. I just want to email you new product or restock of stuff you bought before or, you know, adjacent product. Like one of those things you're just giving money away when people are willing to pay full price.
Catelin: Yeah.
Rich: Um, I'm not willing
Catelin: to pay full price.
Rich: That's
Catelin: true. I'm just going to keep talking to the robots and hope that it works.
Rich: Um, Caitlin needs at least a 25 percent discount. She'd really like a 30 to 50. Um, so we did talk about automation in your search, but you can do that on the. Other side too, right?
Rich: You can automate that B2B, B2C. I talked about the workflow that like, if you've purchased since sale began, don't send subsequent emails. I am however, going to circle back on the last one because it's like a three week sale, whatever the ninth to the 26th is.
Catelin: Okay, yep.
Rich: Ish. So, on the final one that is on, uh, on Christmas Day, I think it is, it's basically Last Chance Last 12 Hours.
Rich: So, it's kind of like, even if you bought, I want everybody to get that one, but you don't need to get the four in between. That's just dumb. Yeah. Um, but, can you over automate?
Catelin: I think so.
Rich: I think if you're smart about it, it would be harder to do, but I think that people aren't always smart about it. You just want to like kick stuff out and be like, Oh, my email program says suggested products, throw those in there.
Rich: Um, but a little bit more thought is, is better. I also think even though like I've got this six week or three week campaign, six emails set on autopilot, I will go in after each one runs and look and see if I need to tweak the future emails. Um, they're all different anyway. I've adjusted them and move things around and like the super cheap stuff is at the top in one and the top in the other.
Rich: The bottom and another one and all that stuff,
Catelin: but I love a little smart content moment for you,
Rich: but I do want to make sure that like, if people are clicking more on the images that I'm going to add more images in, if they're clicking on the few products that I put in, like as product blocks, um, I'm going to want to add more product blocks and back off.
Rich: So, um, and I think that's the real issue with over automating it's impersonal.
Catelin: Yeah.
Rich: And you can lose. It's a lot of, uh, insight that a human just has to make.
Catelin: And I think it's hard to, if you, if you have several automations in place, it's hard to adjust for or account for every potential scenario to where like, we'll start putting automations in place and then it's like, Oh, but what happens if, and then you have to kind of think back through.
Catelin: You know, you're, you're a variety of outcomes.
Rich: Yeah. And we're kind of hitting time, but I want to do hit the, I want to hit this last point about, um, the psychological decision making process. So you bought a purse or a bag. Is it a purse or is it just a bag?
Catelin: Um,
Rich: this is like boat and ship. A boat is small and a ship is big.
Rich: A purse is small and a bag is big.
Catelin: It's a big purse.
Rich: Um, When you buy that, it impacts you and maybe like your kid and your husband, depending on what you stock in that purse. If I were deciding that everyone in our office organization wide has to carry this specific purse, that's a whole different set of considerations, especially since some people probably don't even want a purse.
Rich: Even some of the women might want a smaller purse. Some might want a bigger one. So. You've got, with B2C, you're generally just, it's a very small sphere that you're impacting. Um, but with B2B, I mean, you could be impacting dozens, hundreds, thousands of people. You could be making a purchase on behalf of, you know, Your clients, customers that will impact them.
Rich: Like, you know, what customer service system do we use, et cetera? Um, or my favorite
Catelin: imagine a world though, in which everyone that I work with doesn't want to be exactly like me. So,
Rich: Okay. I think that you just, when you, when we're done with this, you just go out into the office and ask, uh, I'll just pull it.
Rich: I'll just take a poll. Just take a poll. I'll just take a poll. You can do a poll in Slack. I might do that
Catelin: actually.
Rich: Yeah. My favorite one that impacts other people is the psychology of, um, like changing project management software. That's a great one. Please don't ever make us do that again. We probably will at some point, but it's not, not tomorrow.
Rich: Um, not tomorrow. But yeah, you've got to think of a whole lot more people. Ideally. I mean, like you could also just be a jerk as a leader of a company and not think of anybody and just do whatever you want and railroad it through, but you're going to lose employees, right? Your retention is going to on your employees.
Catelin: And that ultimately costs you more money than it does to like listen in the first place.
Rich: And if you're choosing systems that customers see, your end users. And those suck and you didn't think about their needs and take them into consideration, you're going to lose customers, um, and lose efficiency.
Rich: All right. I think that we're, um, just do what we do and
Catelin: do what I do. Just do only what I do because I am the, no, I'm just
Rich: kidding. No, no, no. So we talked about the core differences between B2B and B2C and audience, the buying process, marketing goals, and what you're trying to do with them. Um, talked about some of the, uh, the ways they're similar.
Rich: Because people are in the B2B process, it's human, um, and then got into a few other considerations, uh, for you. So, um, all good stuff and that's all in the transcript and it's, of course, in the episode, so that's great. Um, but yeah, that's, that's an episode.
Catelin: Yeah, thanks for being here. If you have a question about B2B, you have to be here.
Catelin: But it was nice to chat with you as always. If you have a question about B2B, B2C, marketing, automations, HubSpot, anything, my preferred bag, that I'll, I'll be sure to report back on. You can head to ctapodcast. live to shoot us an email, or you may leave us a voice message on our hotline at 4027189971. Your question will make it into a future episode, and we'd love to hear from you.
Rich: Yeah, and if you do follow us on the socials, um, we do have a threads at antidote underscore 71 along with Instagram. Um, we now have a blue sky. So I think I told you that, Zach. Um, I don't think there's anything really there. I might've posted one thing. I may not have posted anything. Um, they do not allow underscores on blue sky.
Rich: So it's just antidote 71. All one word. I could have done a dash, but then the dash underscore gets weird. So I'm like, no, let's just jam it together. Um,
Catelin: so many, so many things.
Rich: Yeah. And we will be back next week, uh, to talk about jingle jangles. Um, in a jingle, the power of audio branding. I was singing beer jingles when I was like three.
Rich: And so my mom had to get me onto like soda jingles. Like she's like, no, like sing the Coke thing. Theme, not the hams theme, uh, for those, I don't know. Where's
Catelin: the fun in that Randy?
Rich: Um, and our, uh, our cocktail will be the chai spice mule.
Catelin: I'm very excited about this. I would like to try spice right now.
Rich: Zach should have little samplers for us, which would be really hard because he's thousands of miles away.
Rich: 1200 miles away. Maybe. I don't know. I know DC was a thousand and something from Omaha. Anyway. Yeah, I want that one. It sounds good.
Catelin: I couldn't agree more.
Rich: All right. Well, we'll see you next week and, uh, talk about that.
Catelin: I can't wait.