61 - Inbound Marketing Basics

Episode Transcript:

Rich: Hey, Caitlin, how are

Catelin: Hi. Hi, Rich. I, you know, all morning I thought it was, I thought it was like two days later than it actually is. But aside from that, I'm doing great.

Rich: Well, you're going to have a little déjà vu because, uh, we recorded this one once and all the audio was missing, as you know, and so we're going to do it again.

Catelin: I know, which is a real heartbreak because I gotta say, I felt very funny. I

Rich: was, I was, We were both

Catelin: high bar

Rich: So if you're disappointed this episode, I'm sorry. There's an unknown episode somewhere out in the cosmos where, uh, our audio went. Um, it said it was recording and it didn't. Um,

Catelin: and we're just as heartbroken as you are.

Rich: Yeah, no, seriously. Um, so anyway, today we're going to talk about Inbound Marketing Basics.

Rich: So we've done a little Inbound 101. We've done some of the, you know, what is inbound, uh, in other forms. So we're hitting that in the podcast. Um, so we'll talk about what it is and how you can implement it in your marketing strategy. But more importantly, This drink is crazy. Apples and pears. It's like a fruit bowl.

Catelin: It is. I, I'm prefer preferring to call it a pair of apples

Rich: Ah, the pun.

Catelin: there's apple, apple flavored vodka and a little hard apple cider. And if you want to go extra, it could be like a triplet of apples, but that doesn't quite fit in because you can garnish with an apple slice. But, uh, this is a fall cocktail.

Rich: It could be a, it could be three apples and a pear, just like, you know, like four weddings and a funeral.

Catelin: I don't like that as much.

Rich: Oh, okay. All right. A pear of apples, but pear is spelled P A R.

Catelin: And then you could, but also. So you would have to pear your apple, potentially,

Rich: Oh, P A R

Catelin: A R E,

Rich: And it's a pear, P A R, because English is easy. English is a such an easy language. There,

Catelin: very confusing,

Rich: You, you're, you're, you're,

Catelin: but also it's uh, it's, it's satisfying if you, if you're in on the joke. Um, this is a fall cocktail crafted by Charlotte Voisey, which combines apple flavored vodka, pear, bitters, and hard cider, with homemade vanilla nut mix.

Catelin: Syrup. And I gotta tell you, if, if I think that the homemade vanilla nutmeg syrup is extra, it's extra, okay? This is, it's, it's involved. And also, kind of expensive. Like, this is a, this is a bougie simple syrup.

Rich: Yeah. And I do want to point out, like, I do still feel like, and I haven't looked it up to see, but, um, apple flavored vodka, not a common thing. Pear vodka, yes. Um, you've, you've bootlegged some of that for me, or I'd not really bootlegged. You just bought it at a store and took it to your house. Um, so that we could do the, uh, lychee cocktails, which use pear vodka.

Rich: Um, but apple vodka, I had, I honestly have never seen an apple flavored vodka. So, um, Charlotte Voicy works for a booze distributor and I'm wondering if this is their apple vodka and they created this and are pushing it and promoting

Catelin: Mm hmm.

Rich: to sell

Catelin: It's a ruse!

Rich: would not be the first time in the history of drink creation that a bartender or booze company has created a drink to use what they have on hand that needs to go away. So,

Catelin: Or vice versa in this case. Maybe they created an apple vodka and they're like, well shit, now what do we do?

Rich: yeah, it could be.

Catelin: you give me a pair of apples.

Rich: there'd be a whole lot of demand for this, but I guess we have to create demand. Um, I do want to say also, Second only to the complexity of the vanilla nutmeg syrup is juicing your own

Catelin: don't do that.

Rich: need equipment for that, but, um, buy some good pear juice or a pear, uh, is it nectar, right?

Rich: I was gonna say extract and I'm like, that's not right. Nectar. Um, and your favorite

Catelin: comes in a can. It's in the, uh, the Latin, Spanish, Mexican, ethnic section of your local grocery store. It's a blue can called Jumex. But it's J U M E X.

Rich: or if you're in Omaha, you can go to Jacobo's and, or Jacobo's as some people say, but it's Jacobo's. Oh, no, I've, I've heard it. Believe me. I was like, oh, I mean, this is the land of Beatrice as a town, not Beatrice, Beatrice, Nebraska. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Um, and you've, uh, well, you guys have mad, you have Madrid,

Catelin: and Nevada, two, two there. Mm

Rich: So anyway, a Kobo's or your local Mexican grocery is going to have this, but most grocery stores have this nectar and it's honestly really great in

Catelin: So good. So good. It's got a little bit more, it's not like a, like an apple juice or like a cranberry juice where you get, like, you just have the, the flavor and the color. It's got a little bit more, like, viscosity and the body of it is so much better, because it's,

Rich: Yeah, because it's a

Catelin: it's not like, it's not pulpy, but it is, it's like, it's thicker.

Catelin: Mm, it's making my mouth

Rich: So this vanilla nutmeg syrup also, and then we'll get to how you put it all together. Um, basically you make simple syrup, you throw some nutmeg and six vanilla beans cut in half lengthwise to infuse in here. Um,

Catelin: Six

Rich: they aren't, vanilla beans aren't, they're not terribly pricey, but they're not super cheap.

Catelin: But also, who has the frackin time to scrape out six vanilla

Rich: This doesn't make you scrape it. You just cut them in half lengthwise and throw them in because it's going to steep in there and flavor out. Um,

Catelin: I'm still not sold on this. When you buy, when you buy vanilla beans at like, uh, at a Hy Vee, which is where I buy my vanilla beans, I've never bought vanilla beans, but if I was going to, they come like three. In a container.

Rich: Oh, you can get them in bulk on the internet. The internets have, uh, have bulk, um, vanilla beans that

Catelin: You're the reason

Rich: Maybe Zach

Catelin: are food deserts.

Rich: bulk vanilla beans, but so here's what I would try. So we have pure like. Like very good, pure vanilla extract. Like it's from Mexico. It's really wonderful. I would try this with, I would start with just a little bit of that.

Rich: Although you can't really taste simple syrup because it's so hot until it cools, I have to smell it. So anyway, you make a simple syrup, two cups, sugar, two teaspoons, ground nutmeg, six vanilla beans cut in half and two cups water. Simple syrup is always equal parts, water and sugar. And then whatever else you want to throw in there, cook it on low heat, stir it until it's all dissolved and let it cool into a closed container stored in the refrigerator.

Rich: It will keep longer. Um, or just go find your, I mean, I don't know if you can find vanilla, simple syrup. I know there's a vanilla maple syrup like that I've had for pancakes, but that would make this a whole different drink anyway. Um,

Catelin: Godspeed on the syrup, guys.

Rich: yeah. So once. Once you have all those, you can, uh, as usual, put your vodka, pear juice, syrup, lime juice, and bitters all into a shaker and shake them with ice until your hand is freezing.

Rich: Uh, strain it into a double old fashioned glass, um, or

Catelin: I mean, like, just use a

Rich: The Collins glass is fine. I mean, honestly, a pint glass is fine. Nobody's going to really care, uh, over some fresh ice. So don't use your dirty ice from your drink. Use

Catelin: Mm hmm.

Rich: uh, top it off with a hard cider because remember we don't put fizzy things in the shaker.

Rich: Um, then garnish with your apple slice, sprinkle some fresh grated nutmeg over it. Um, and yeah, there you go. So that's from liquor. com via Charlotte Voicy, um,

Catelin: Ta da!

Rich: think is probably just a shill for apple flavored vodka. Um, all right. So I think that, I think we did it, Caitlin. So we can talk about, we can take a break first of all, cause I need a break after that.

Rich: That was a lot. Just a simple syrup. I need a

Catelin: go I know. It's the syrup. So much. I wanna, I wanna spend a little bit more time just reminiscing about all of the lunches in Honduras that I had kiddos drinking, like,

Rich: Oh, cause so we bring up nectar. It reminds you of humex, which you had in Honduras. And then we go back to Honduras and now it's the food because we're very food centric. I

Catelin: Yeah,

Rich: get it. So what was

Catelin: love a little like, uh, like a bal a balayada. So it's like a homemade flour tortilla with beans, refried beans. And then they have like, um, like queso fresco. And then my mouth is fully watering. It was so good. And then, um, and then, uh, crema, like sort of sour cream, but it was like sweeter.

Catelin: Just like, and then you just fold it into like a little quesadilla and

Rich: Somebody follow somebody that I could. Follow on Instagram. I have no idea who it's probably somebody that I know, but they have a South American boyfriend who they filmed making, uh, a rapist from

Catelin: Oh yeah,

Rich: Well, we will take a quick break and then we'll be back to talk about inbound marketing and some of the basics. Well, and with that, we're back.

Catelin: it

Rich: Hey, anytime somebody else does a big sigh, I'm gonna make a reference to it so that it must be kept in

Catelin: stimulates your vagus nerve. It's good for stress relief.

Rich: It's good for extra oxygen, like you could, you get out a lot of carbon dioxide, and so you have to inhale deeper for more oxygen. It's a good thing. As Martha Stewart used to say, right? Was she the one? It's a good thing. Good

Catelin: I don't know. I, so like, I didn't ever, I didn't ever watch Martha Stewart. Like, by the time I

Rich: You she was a felon.

Catelin: age, yeah, like, I, I was consuming Martha Stewart. Doer as like an inside traitor, and then now she's come back around as the best friend of Snoop Dogg, which

Rich: so she started out pre Snoop and pre prison. She just started out being like the quintessential cooking show lady.

Catelin: Oh, no, she's like a waspy New Englander. I know exactly like her her history Yeah, it just like I didn't I didn't consume that type of Martha Stewart Content now she's like isn't she like 70 and she's babe Just like

Rich: I don't know, maybe. I mean, we've talked about this. 70 is the new 50, 50 is the new 35, 35 is the new 12. So, um, no, that's not right. 35 is the new 25. I think that's what it is. Mhm.

Catelin: I don't I don't think so I don't know. I don't think we have

Rich: twenty five the new twelve? I did read a thing today that said, um, when you, uh, when you're thirty five, you feel like you're thirty nine.

Rich: When you're thirty six, you're suddenly fifty.

Catelin: Well, I'll be 37 in like four days, and I don't feel 50, but I also don't feel 25.

Rich: Correct. Zach wants to know what twenty five would be. So, thirty five would be the new twenty five is the new twelve, Zach.

Catelin: I think 25 is like 18.

Rich: It might be. I

Catelin: like old enough, but you're not like, I don't

Rich: for me, eighteen to twenty nine, we're all kind of one compressed group. No, I didn't do that until I was in my Not until I was in my 30s in Chicago. Um, I was in really They repressed small towns like in my 20s. It wasn't anything like great All right. So, um, I think Zach's probably gonna cut half of that out because we're rambling but that was a big tangent So let's talk about Caitlin.

Rich: What is inbound marketing?

Catelin: What is end Pretend like, I don't know. 'cause some days I don't feel like I do

Rich: we are having a Tuesday on a Tuesday Inbound marketing so HubSpot kind of coined They didn't really invent inbound marketing, it's a thing, but they really, like, pushed it to the mainstream, I think. So it's a methodology where you attract customers to you instead of, like, pushing your audience, pushing your message to people who don't want to hear it.

Rich: So it's the opposite of cold calling. So the, um, Can I talk to you about your home or your car warranty, uh, is the opposite of inbound. Inbound would be I'm searching for car warranty and I find some options and I choose one and I go there. Um, so it's really making tailored marketing experience by using content.

Rich: We all hear content is kings, content is queen, content is like the best. Um, it has to be valuable though. It has to be something that people are, They got to want to give you their information. So what do I have to give you for you to give me your email address? What more do I have to give? If you're going to give me your phone number, like that's a big one.

Rich: Um, cause I can unsubscribe, but if you're going to call me like 43 times short of me picking up the phone, actually answering and yelling at you, um, it's really hard to unsubscribe from that. Um, so basically. You bring customers to you and use your content to help drive their engagement with you, ideally convert them to a customer client, and then help them grow.

Rich: So that's what it is.

Catelin: The end.

Rich: We're done. Zach, we ended early. Um, okay, so, um, Some people would be like, why does it work? So we know that cold calling and cold email is a volume game, right? It's the same thing with spam. It's just the more you put out, the more likely it is that somebody will hit. Um, Inbound marketing doesn't work that way.

Catelin: it. It's still, I will say it is still kind of a volume game. It's just like a quality over quantity volume, you know?

Rich: It's not as high and you can actually improve your, your scores with better quality and not have to improve any volume. So you really do look at those conversion rates and there are ways to improve those, um, with what you're putting out there and where you're putting it, right? So the goal here is to get in front of your potential audience, your potential customer with something that they're looking for a problem, you can solve a solution for them.

Rich: Or sometimes it's pointing out a problem they have. Like, um, we've got some headlines that are like, is your website working as hard as it should? Well, now I've got, now I don't know that maybe it's not shit. I have no idea.

Catelin: No, I don't know, is it? Can you tell me?

Rich: So yeah, we can. Um, and then basically, um, leading them along a nurture journey so that they, um, they can understand they have a problem. They can look for solutions to that problem. Your content is there where they're looking for that. And, uh, ideally. They come to you to solve the problem. Um, it's not a hard sell though.

Rich: Like I think that people think people miss too is with inbound. That middle of the funnel is a consultative piece. You're still not pushing your solution. You might be starting to lean them toward it, but you're helping them explore others, explore solutions to this problem that they've raised or you've raised the end of the funnel is where you're like, and by the way, I've been helping you this whole time.

Rich: So you should just come to me and use my solution. Um,

Catelin: By the way, I know more, it's like Ron Swanson standing in Menards, I know more than you. But kindly, you

Rich: Same thing. Menards featured on SNL, but they got it wrong. What they said, uh, that 10

Catelin: Can you even believe,

Rich: it's

Catelin: it's 11!

Rich: And it was funny to me because Jen, Jen, is it Jen Saki, the former press

Catelin: uh, yeah,

Rich: was like, no notes. And everybody's like, I got one

Catelin: except one, right? And everybody knows it!

Rich: And I believe Tim Walls would have like corrected her on that as well. But SNL, like, okay, the writers in New York disconnected from the perpetual Menards rebate of 11%.

Catelin: can I just say that I, before Tim Walls was a Menards guy to the general public, I was interviewed by Funny or Die, and that was the question they asked, is, is Tim Walls a Lowe's or a Home Depot guy? And I was like, he's a Menards guy.

Rich: Nice.

Catelin: what is Menards? And I was like, what the hell?

Rich: But when you get Tim to do an interview, you can ask him. No, it was really, really funny. Um, They, uh, they had some good shots there. So anyway, I talked

Catelin: not do any inbound marketing, let's be very clear about that. Mm

Rich: just do broadcasts. Um, all right. So we talked a little bit about high quality content, getting it where your audience is. So you have to know where your audience is and what they're doing.

Rich: Right. So that is part of the buyer's journey. It's like, take off your sales hat because if we don't need it, put on your buyer hat, what steps are they going through? What are they consuming? Personas are very handy here. Basically. How are they researching their problem? How are they discovering they have a problem?

Rich: How are they considering different solutions? Where are those things at and how do you get in front of them? Uh, and of course there's one giant behemoth obvious one where people go to look for problems and answers.

Catelin: Google.

Rich: Yes. Thank you for picking that up. I know we're, uh, we're, uh, Maybe

Catelin: a, it's a

Rich: It's a lot.

Catelin: Mm hmm.

Rich: That feels like a Thursday. That feels like a Monday. Um, yeah, so Google, well, Google's a huge one. And that's why Google PPC works so well. And Google has so much search. Um, AI is starting to play in that territory.

Rich: Um, those sometimes accurately, sometimes inaccurately, I believe we talked about the, uh, glue and pizza sauce recommendation that AI was putting out. Um, so don't trust AI completely. And honestly, you can't trust every result on Google. The quality is different. Um, but presumably your content will rise to the top if it is quality and comes closer to their question.

Rich: Um, there's other things you can do with SCA. Markup and schema, it's called to make sure that your questions and answers show up. Um,

Catelin: Ema. It's a fun word.

Rich: it is, it's a very fun word. So people are basically going through like three things and we've heard these a million times in marketing classes, awareness, consideration, and decision. Um, so awareness, either they're aware of the problem or you make them aware of the problem. Um, and they're looking for just information, resources, and answers.

Rich: Consideration. They really have defined their problem and now they're looking for a true solution. They've kind of looked at. The whole big field of everything they could do. And now they want, they want to try to narrow it down to one thing. This is where your content can be really, really, really help helpful.

Rich: Um, and then decision. So, and that's really your sales point with inbound is that decision you're just kind of selling all along, but you're soft selling a little bit. Um, but at the decision point, that's where you really want to bring them in, um, and get them attracted to you. So, yeah.

Catelin: What is lead gen?

Rich: Okay. So Legion

Catelin: After all of that.

Rich: synonymously with inbound. Um, they are very similar and they work together and play together, but it's the. Idea of attracting and converting strangers and prospects into someone. Um, you do lead generation with inbound marketing. So that's, they are related. They're not exactly synonymous, but they're very, very closely related.

Rich: So basically somebody who's indicated interest in your company's product or service becomes a lead. A lead is not a list of people that you bought from some debt, third party database that does not work. Um, these leads are truly people who've expressed some sort of an interest. They filled out a form.

Rich: They've asked you a question. Um, they've been visiting pages on your website, those types of things. Um, you really run into lead generation every single day. Um, job applications can be lead gen, right? Cause we're trying to grab leads with a job application. Um, the whole point is fill out that form, uh, blog posts.

Catelin: Yeah,

Rich: live events, uh, online content, all of those can be examples of lead generation. So like trade shows, we were just at inbound not too long ago. Uh, live event,

Catelin: got an I got a follow up email from one of the booths I stopped at today.

Rich: I got one from one and I will not name them, but they said, hope you love your bag. And I'm like, I wrote back and said, when I stopped by your booth, there were no bags left.

Catelin: Oh,

Rich: you offered me a water bottle and I declined because I already had my, uh, Big giant 32 ounce Yeti water bottle from HubSpot and G2.

Rich: Oh, 36. Wow. Oh,

Catelin: she's a big mama.

Rich: follow up to that episode. We did have a lid with a straw in it. We actually had two. So Brian has graciously given me one of the lids with the straw for

Catelin: Oh Wow,

Rich: Um, he gave me the black one though, and he kept the orange lid and I'm like, I want the orange lid, but he's like, no, I want the orange lid.

Rich: So. There we are. Um, but yeah, so, you know, you click badges or you exchange business cards, all of those, you're, you're gathering leads, right. Um, and those people have in some way, shape or form expressed interest to you. Um, lead gen is not the AT& T booth at Costco, where as you walk by, they try to get you to switch phone providers or sign up for a cell phone.

Rich: Um, but I don't know who doesn't have a cell phone. I guess there's some people, but it's gotta be really small.

Catelin: I talked to a woman the other day who only had a flip phone granted. She was 90 years old. So, you

Rich: But, but. Younger people are going back to that though, because the smartphone is such an intrusive device. There are people who are going to simplify and they're just going

Catelin: Mm hmm.

Rich: T9 as we called it.

Catelin: Oh, yeah wordy. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah

Rich: Um, so anyway, you interact with leadgen all day, every day. Any email that you get is probably because you did something that generate to generate a lead.

Rich: You're a lead for Somebody. Um, so yeah. Um, so I think the only other kind of things we have, a couple things, we've got a few minutes left, probably six or seven minutes, I'm guessing based on Zach's timer. Um, Lead generation, though, like, how do you do it? So, what does content look like? Like, we say content, and it's just this big, like, I don't know, what's content?

Rich: Like, everything's content. That brick wall is content. That painting is content. Um, yeah, sort of.

Catelin: Oh God, it's like, um, what's the, it's like everything is, everything is, um, everything is content. Is that a thing?

Rich: So I go to everything is awesome from the Lego movie. If you say everything

Catelin: everything is cool and you're part of the team.

Rich: And then I start singing. Um, that's how it works. Um, so yeah, so anyway, landing pages are a great place because landing pages are like your website pages, but they don't have external, like they don't have navigation to take people away.

Rich: The goal is that it's a contained experience. On that page. And I either leave the page or I fill out your form and do what you want me to do. Uh, so, and many pages can contain other things. They can contain a downloadable offer. They can contain a calculator. They can contain all kinds of things. Um, you can also generate leads just using organic and paid social media.

Rich: Uh, Facebook and LinkedIn both have what they call lead ads where people basically one click. Fill out a form that, cause we know Facebook and LinkedIn know their email address, right? Um, So those can be really handy. Obviously emails, this is one, um, search engine optimization. So getting your stuff in front of people there, um, or referral marketing.

Rich: So one, um, I think we talked about it in our email episode. I'm sure Charlotte touched on this cause she's brought it up several times to me is in your marketing emails that go out or your newsletter have forward to a friend. On there. That's a referral. Um, you can also give people an offer for referring to a friend.

Rich: If you refer to a friend and they buy and they use your name as in the coupon code, then you'll get 20 percent off next time or Um, so it's, it's really just about having some sort of a point of view, understanding where your audience is, having things you put in front of them at those places and pieces.

Rich: Um, That's, um, that's, that's inbound. So, um, if you're

Catelin: I always, I, I kind of liken it and we've talked about this with some clients too where inbound marketing is. Really about like that full circle, like you're just trying to serve the customer wherever they are and your, your customer service questions and like outreach or,

Rich: Mm hmm.

Catelin: ways in which people are contacting you with problems or questions can really inform the rest of your inbound structure because it's like if people that have already purchased from me are having these questions likely somebody else in that process is also having those questions and so you can use that kind of full circle or like full 30, 000 foot view of your, your customer path to inform your, your marketing strategy.

Catelin: And it's less like you, you touched on this earlier. It's less about directly selling all of the time and more about serving your client or your customer in a way that is meaningful to them. So it's not like, buy now, click here, buy now, buy now, buy now. It's like, here's some information that might help you make a more informed decision.

Catelin: Here's why our product might help you along your way, or, you know, why we're the experts at this. Like, it's a little bit more subtle and, um, not quite so yelly. Yeah.

Rich: Yeah. I think the other, the other example that we've used and I use that there's a, there's a sanitized version of this and then there's a not safe for work version. I'm just going to use the sanitized, but it's like going to a bar, right? It's. It's like going into a bar and screaming, who wants to marry me?

Rich: Or worse cold calling. It's like going up and being like, do you want to marry me? Do you want to marry me? Do you want to marry me? Do you want to marry me? Uh, we laugh and it's ridiculous, but that's exactly what it's like versus inbound is like, Going on a couple of blind dates, or getting matched with some people, being interested in them, and going on a journey to get to know them to determine if you want to spend time with them or don't.

Rich: Um, inbound is

Catelin: it's, it's also like providing that social proof, right? That like, oh, that's where that referral comes in. Somebody that I know and trust, or somebody who looks and sounds

Rich: Oh, yeah.

Catelin: has purchased this product or used this service, and I can see myself in them. If other people are doing it, I wanna do it too.

Rich: Yeah. So I want to wrap up with, um, it's not hard to get started within Bamberg, you probably have assets already that you can use. If you've got a brochure or product information or, uh, blogs that you've been using, um, you can also, you know, use AI to generate ideas for your business, uh, wouldn't have them have it do the whole thing there.

Rich: A human does need to weigh in on there. Like for all the reasons we said, you know, glue and tomato sauce or pizza sauce. Um, Um, but the idea is that you've got a product or service that you could Look at that customer's journey around, literally sit down and map out their journey, where are they going to find information?

Rich: Where are they going to find answers? What are their problems? You've also presumably got customers, right? And to your point, what are your customers? Issues when they onboard, what are the hurdles they get up? You should solve those, but also those are problems other people are probably having, and you can put out things about that and it can be like, Hey, have you noticed your leads have fallen off from your website?

Rich: Have you noticed your You know, organic search has fallen off. Your traffic has fallen off. Here's why that might be. Here's how we can help. And really you just have to put together two or three pieces of content. Um, you want something to kind of try to bring them in and then, and get that out there via, you know, some ads.

Rich: Um, you can do 10 a day in most platforms. You'll be good. And then, um. You can, uh, also, um, have a couple of things to follow up with them on, but honestly, once they grab something, you're more than you should reach out to them, you know, ask if you could help offer to be consultative and then just let your natural sales process, you know, take over from there, um, in a non invasive way, but yeah, start with something.

Rich: If you don't start today, you'll never get where you need to be. So, I think that's, uh, an episode, Caitlin.

Catelin: that's it again.

Rich: yep. And I am, uh, before you thank everybody, I'm supposed to tell them that we have another episode coming next week because we're weekly now. Uh, assuming these all actually record and there's audio at the end of this and Zach can put it together.

Rich: Uh, if you're, well, if there's not, you're not hearing this. So, um, but our drink is a weird one. It's the tea ceremony. Um, so, um, there's tea in it, I'm sure. Um, And we're going to talk about WordPress versus HubSpot CMS. And we can get into some of the

Catelin: I

Rich: on with WordPress. There is some drama. We will spill the tea, Caitlin.

Rich: We will spill the tea.

Catelin: and I cannot wait.

Rich: all right. So how did people find us?

Catelin: you can find us at Antidote under 71 and if you have question you'd like to send our way, you can visit CTA podcast live to send us a message, or you can leave us a voice message on our hotline at 4 0 2 7 1 8. 89971, and your question might make it into a future episode, but it probably will.

Rich: Oh, it will. And we may have gifts. Uh, we'll talk about that maybe in the next episode, but there may be gifts coming this fall for people who leave voicemails. Um, I'll just say it. We'll, we'll send a gift to people who leave a voicemail, but we'll talk a little more about that in the next episode. So you've got to join us then.

Rich: Um, but yeah,

Catelin: I get a gift?

Rich: you will get one a hundred percent. You'll even get one of the faint, there's a fancy gift and there's a less fancy gift. You'll get one of the fancy ones. I promise. Yeah, I'm, uh, I'm,

Catelin: for my fancy gift.

Rich: I'm taking a fancy one, too, so.

Catelin: That's not surprising to anyone who knows you. Hehehehe.

Rich: All right, well, I will see you next time, Caitlin. It's been wonderful.

Rich: Go, uh, go scrape some vanilla beans.